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Struggling with reading above SC 5/6 level

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    Struggling with reading above SC 5/6 level

    So, we're doing SC 5/6 this year. We're two weeks in. My son did grade 3 literature last year. He isn't ready to move on to 4th grade literature this year. We tried the Moffats, but it's clearly past his threshold.

    I'm not sure where to go from here.

    He got through grade 3 with tandem reading last year. The storylines kept him intrigued and encouraged him to power through. Comprehension is very good. I tried the one 'alternate' literature selection for grade 3 and that was too challenging. So....where do we go from here? We did the SC 5/6 science reading today and he read the 'read independently' section well enough to answer all of the comprehension questions.

    Suggestions?
    Married to DH for 14 years. Living the rural life in the Colorado mountains

    DS11- Simply Classical 5/6
    DD9- Simply Classical 5/6 (neurotypical, but schooling with big brother to save mom's sanity)
    DD 6- Classic Core First Grade

    We've completed:
    Classic Core Jr. kindergarten, kindergarten, first grade, and second grade.
    Simply Classical levels B, C, 1, 2, 3, and 4.

    #2
    Did you do the SC3 am history readers, with SC3? I am doing SC3 Enrichment with all my kiddos this year and 2/3 of the kids are tandem reading them with me. I realize in your situation everyone reading together may not be ideal, but if you have them, and you read them aloud 2 years ago, perhaps you could tandem read them this year. They are in the 5/6 guild if it would make him baulk at repeating them. I did also re-buy the writing book.
    Christine

    (2019/2020)
    DD1 8/23/09 - SC5/6
    DS2 9/1/11 - SC3,4, 5/6 combo
    DD3 2/9/13 -SC2 to start, MP1 second semester

    Previous Years
    DD 1 (MPK, SC2 (with AAR), SC3, SC4’
    DS2 (SCB, SCC, MPK, SC2)
    DD3 (SCA, SCB, Jr. K workbooks, soaking up from the others, MPK)

    Comment


      #3
      Yes, I remember he moved quickly through MP literature, so I can see how this happened.

      Our SC literature progression spreads out K, 1, 2 literature a little more:

      SC 2 - MP First
      SC 3 - MP Second intro
      SC 4 - MP Second continued
      SC 5&6 - MP Third

      He is "on track" for SC! The only dilemma arises because he has already read the MP Third literature.

      I remember when he was back in the earlier SC levels he balked initially at rereading selections but found that his fluency improved by doing so. If he could use work on composition, my recommendation would be to reread through MP Third Literature from the beginning using the SC 5&6 plans. Add the literature guides for composition, vocabulary, and oral language if you did not require these before. Add the new Intro to Comp as scheduled with the MP Third Literature. Ideally this rereading would be less tandem, more independent, and more fluent for him. You could explain that the focus of this year's literature will be becoming a stronger writer. In other words, now that he knows the stories and characters so well, he will be working on composition through those stories. He would still have plenty of other new reading through the Ext. Lit selections, the read-aloud D'Aulaires', the science content, the more advanced Bible Stories, and any other audiobooks he hears in his free time.

      This would be my choice for him because he is reading well at the SC 5&6 science level. Congratulations on this, by the way!

      If he is like many students, his reading fluency and composition abilities are still lagging a bit behind his comprehension, so this year he can use those familiar stories to strengthen both reading fluency and composition. This will make Lit a little easier this year, but with all of the other challenging content in SC 5&6, that might be welcome!

      Comment


        #4
        Did he complete the second grade readers? Sorry my son was too old when SC came out so I am not exactly on top of the contents of the SC levels. The letters are guided reading level rating, the number is Lexile level.
        Prairie School M/410
        Courage of Sarah Noble O/610
        Little House in the Big Woods Q/930
        Beatrix Potter N

        Farmer Boy Q/820
        Charlotte’s Web R/680
        Bear Called Paddington T/?
        Mr. Popper’s Penguins Q/910

        Cricket in Times Square S/780
        Homer Price Q

        Moffets ?/800
        My Side of the Mountain U/810

        I don’t know exactly how the numbers and letters correlate, but they confirm my impression that second grade starts easy and then has a huge jump. Little House in the Big Woods brought my current 11yo to tears at that age and we had to take a huge step back (that was the summer I bought AAR3 and came to Sodalitas for the first time). All of the 3rd grade readers seemed to be about at that same level. Cricket in Times Square would indicate that it is harder, but only slightly so in my estimation. Homer Price looks like the same level as the 3rd grade lit. Both stories are really good for boys! There is another huge jump in the 4th grade page when you get to Blue Fairy. My daughter read the Moffats back in the dark ages and I would say that it isn’t going to be the most engaging storyline for a boy to work through. Honestly, I didn’t really engage with it. I know that doesn’t have to be the goal for every book, but it certainly helps. The guided reading level on My Side of the Mountain is higher, but it is an awesome boy book and a great read aloud! Much more engaging than the Moffats!

        I guess I would look at the end of second grade if you haven’t completed those and maybe try Homer Price as a starting point. Hope that helps a bit!
        Dorinda

        For 2019-2020
        DD 16 - 11th with MPOA(AP Latin), Lukeion (Greek4 & Adv. NT Greek), Thinkwell (Economics and Chemistry), plus Pre-Calculus, American G’ment, Early Church History set, and British Lit
        DS 14 - 8th with MPOA(Fourth Form), CLRC(Intro Lit and Comp), plus Algebra, Field Biology, Classical Studies 1
        DS 11 - 6th with Right Start Level G online class
        DS 6 - 1st with Prima Latina

        Comment


          #5
          My son completed third grade lit / SC 5/6 lit last year complete with lit guides and intro to composition. He did fine with it. I'm not looking to repeat that. I'm looking to continue with that level of reading in order to bridge him upwards.

          I guess maybe this is a suggestion for SC 7/8. My son could not move from 5/6 to the next step in literature smoothly. Re-reading the same literature selections again isn't the answer.

          I am using the SC 3 history read-alouds this year as our enrichment. All three of my kids are enjoying them. We are even adding them to our timeline as we 'discover' each person.

          We have read my side of the mountain (and others in that series) as bedtime stories. I agree...great boy books, but definitely above his personal reading level.

          But great point from that list...two books to try would be Homer price and Paddington.
          Married to DH for 14 years. Living the rural life in the Colorado mountains

          DS11- Simply Classical 5/6
          DD9- Simply Classical 5/6 (neurotypical, but schooling with big brother to save mom's sanity)
          DD 6- Classic Core First Grade

          We've completed:
          Classic Core Jr. kindergarten, kindergarten, first grade, and second grade.
          Simply Classical levels B, C, 1, 2, 3, and 4.

          Comment


            #6
            One other thing we did at that stage when we were trying to hang out at the reading level of the third grade package was to alternate a book with a literature guide and a book to team read and just discuss. If you look, many of the books have sequels. There are something like 14 Paddington books, a sequel to Homer Price, several to cricket, and the whole little house series. I also wouldn’t discount some of the picture books from authors in the k-2 enrichment sets as good independent or team reading. One of our libraries pulls out a number of them as “illustrated shorts” and puts them over with books for the older set. Alas, they are remodeling/expanding the youth room this fall so most all of their books are in storage or long term checkout.
            Dorinda

            For 2019-2020
            DD 16 - 11th with MPOA(AP Latin), Lukeion (Greek4 & Adv. NT Greek), Thinkwell (Economics and Chemistry), plus Pre-Calculus, American G’ment, Early Church History set, and British Lit
            DS 14 - 8th with MPOA(Fourth Form), CLRC(Intro Lit and Comp), plus Algebra, Field Biology, Classical Studies 1
            DS 11 - 6th with Right Start Level G online class
            DS 6 - 1st with Prima Latina

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Colomama View Post
              My son completed third grade lit / SC 5/6 lit last year complete with lit guides and intro to composition. He did fine with it. I'm not looking to repeat that. I'm looking to continue with that level of reading in order to bridge him upwards.

              I guess maybe this is a suggestion for SC 7/8. My son could not move from 5/6 to the next step in literature smoothly. Re-reading the same literature selections again isn't the answer.

              I am using the SC 3 history read-alouds this year as our enrichment. All three of my kids are enjoying them. We are even adding them to our timeline as we 'discover' each person.

              We have read my side of the mountain (and others in that series) as bedtime stories. I agree...great boy books, but definitely above his personal reading level.

              But great point from that list...two books to try would be Homer price and Paddington.
              Thanks for the extra information. Agreeing that because he already completed both the literature guides and Intro to Comp with those selections, repeating is not the answer.

              You mentioned SC 7&8. We have been looking closely at this very issue. Here is some information that might help you decide:


              Title, reading grade level, lexile

              Charlotte's Web, 4.4, 680
              Farmer Boy, 5.2, 820
              Moffats, 5.2, 800
              Bear Called Paddington, xx, 750
              Lassie, 5.4, 780
              Lion, Witch, & Wardrobe, 5.7, 940
              Homer Price, 6.6, 1000





              Comment


                #8
                Yes, collaborating with Dorinda's idea, you might select a book or two from the Supplemental Third Grade Reading List for reading practice.
                Summer and Enrichment Reading In the Memoria Press/HLS literature curriculum, students read three or four good books in depth with study guides every year. Students should also be reading additional books during the school year and especially during leisure time in the summers. The books we recommend for grades 3-up …

                Comment


                  #9
                  Michelle,

                  Are you using the American History readers from MP3? Meet George Washington, Meet Thomas Jefferson, etc.? That's one suggestion.

                  It also seems like a good plan to tackle Paddington, Homer Price and then maybe give Moffats another try?

                  Finally, some chapter book series like Encyclopedia Brown, Boxcar Children, etc.

                  SusanP in VA

                  Comment


                    #10
                    One nice thing about the MP3 American history readers is you can purchase a small little guide with discussion questions. If he is at the point that he wants to read to himself I like having a way to check without having read it myself.
                    https://www.memoriapress.com/curricu...de-discussion/
                    Dorinda

                    For 2019-2020
                    DD 16 - 11th with MPOA(AP Latin), Lukeion (Greek4 & Adv. NT Greek), Thinkwell (Economics and Chemistry), plus Pre-Calculus, American G’ment, Early Church History set, and British Lit
                    DS 14 - 8th with MPOA(Fourth Form), CLRC(Intro Lit and Comp), plus Algebra, Field Biology, Classical Studies 1
                    DS 11 - 6th with Right Start Level G online class
                    DS 6 - 1st with Prima Latina

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by cherylswope View Post

                      Thanks for the extra information. Agreeing that because he already completed both the literature guides and Intro to Comp with those selections, repeating is not the answer.

                      You mentioned SC 7&8. We have been looking closely at this very issue. Here is some information that might help you decide:


                      Title, reading grade level, lexile

                      Charlotte's Web, 4.4, 680
                      Farmer Boy, 5.2, 820
                      Moffats, 5.2, 800
                      Bear Called Paddington, xx, 750
                      Lassie, 5.4, 780
                      Lion, Witch, & Wardrobe, 5.7, 940
                      Homer Price, 6.6, 1000




                      Cheryl,

                      Where do you find the grade level equivalent? I looked books up on the scholastic website, but they usually gave n/a for grade level equivalent. As I mentioned, I have never figured out how the different methods evaluate the difficulty because sometimes they seem to come up with different rankings of difficulty.
                      Dorinda

                      For 2019-2020
                      DD 16 - 11th with MPOA(AP Latin), Lukeion (Greek4 & Adv. NT Greek), Thinkwell (Economics and Chemistry), plus Pre-Calculus, American G’ment, Early Church History set, and British Lit
                      DS 14 - 8th with MPOA(Fourth Form), CLRC(Intro Lit and Comp), plus Algebra, Field Biology, Classical Studies 1
                      DS 11 - 6th with Right Start Level G online class
                      DS 6 - 1st with Prima Latina

                      Comment


                        #12
                        The above list, which I'm consulting for SC 7&8 and beyond, comes from Mrs. Lowe's own notes. The link from which she obtained these no longer seems to provide an easily accessible list, but perhaps someone here will know of a reliable source for narrow grade equivalents. Often a wider range is given for either ages or grades.

                        I agree with you that
                        even Lexiles seem conflicting or oddly assigned. And one person's idea of fifth grade is different than another's. Complicating matters more, a book's difficulty may be different for any given child simply because of a child's background or language abilities. Clearly none of this is so exact as numbers might appear. Sometimes I find that my own "in-house counsel" is most intuitively reliable: "That book will creep them out," or "I couldn't make heads or tails of that book. It will be too confusing!


                        If anyone here has a good source for grade equivalents of children's literature, please share.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by cherylswope View Post
                          The above list, which I'm consulting for SC 7&8 and beyond, comes from Mrs. Lowe's own notes. The link from which she obtained these no longer seems to provide an easily accessible list, but perhaps someone here will know of a reliable source for narrow grade equivalents. Often a wider range is given for either ages or grades.

                          I agree with you that
                          even Lexiles seem conflicting or oddly assigned. And one person's idea of fifth grade is different than another's. Complicating matters more, a book's difficulty may be different for any given child simply because of a child's background or language abilities. Clearly none of this is so exact as numbers might appear. Sometimes I find that my own "in-house counsel" is most intuitively reliable: "That book will creep them out," or "I couldn't make heads or tails of that book. It will be too confusing!



                          If anyone here has a good source for grade equivalents of children's literature, please share.
                          I have no idea if this is reliable?

                          http://languageartsreading.dadeschoo...rsionChart.pdf
                          or this
                          https://lexile.com/parents-students/...ance-by-grade/
                          Last edited by howiecram; 08-16-2019, 05:45 PM.
                          Christine

                          (2019/2020)
                          DD1 8/23/09 - SC5/6
                          DS2 9/1/11 - SC3,4, 5/6 combo
                          DD3 2/9/13 -SC2 to start, MP1 second semester

                          Previous Years
                          DD 1 (MPK, SC2 (with AAR), SC3, SC4’
                          DS2 (SCB, SCC, MPK, SC2)
                          DD3 (SCA, SCB, Jr. K workbooks, soaking up from the others, MPK)

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Christine,
                            Thank you for the links. The first one doesn’t mesh with Cheryl’s numbers. The second one from lexile looks more useful and shows the overlap between grade levels.

                            This was what I had been using, but they seem to have deleted the grade level equivalent. Wondering if it has fallen out of favor. https://www.scholastic.com/content/t...-michael-bond/

                            I do like Cheryl’s comment about “in house counsel.” I get hand me down books from a friend who has her kids score books on a 0-5 scale of how well they liked it. The books all have these little post it notes on the cover with the kid’s initial and their rating. Very handy!



                            Dorinda

                            For 2019-2020
                            DD 16 - 11th with MPOA(AP Latin), Lukeion (Greek4 & Adv. NT Greek), Thinkwell (Economics and Chemistry), plus Pre-Calculus, American G’ment, Early Church History set, and British Lit
                            DS 14 - 8th with MPOA(Fourth Form), CLRC(Intro Lit and Comp), plus Algebra, Field Biology, Classical Studies 1
                            DS 11 - 6th with Right Start Level G online class
                            DS 6 - 1st with Prima Latina

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by SPearson View Post
                              Michelle,

                              Are you using the American History readers from MP3? Meet George Washington, Meet Thomas Jefferson, etc.? That's one suggestion.

                              It also seems like a good plan to tackle Paddington, Homer Price and then maybe give Moffats another try?

                              Finally, some chapter book series like Encyclopedia Brown, Boxcar Children, etc.

                              SusanP in VA

                              We are using the full set of American history readers from SC3. They are scheduled as optional read-alouds in SC 5/6 with a lot more books added in. This set includes almost all, if not all, of the history readers from grade 3.

                              I have that little book. I am going to look through the grade 3 schedule and look at the pacing of those books. Maybe this would be a good idea.

                              Thanks for this idea.

                              I think reading the books as scheduled in 5/6 would be too fast a pace, but maybe using the selected books from grade 3 would be a better fit pacing-wise.
                              Married to DH for 14 years. Living the rural life in the Colorado mountains

                              DS11- Simply Classical 5/6
                              DD9- Simply Classical 5/6 (neurotypical, but schooling with big brother to save mom's sanity)
                              DD 6- Classic Core First Grade

                              We've completed:
                              Classic Core Jr. kindergarten, kindergarten, first grade, and second grade.
                              Simply Classical levels B, C, 1, 2, 3, and 4.

                              Comment

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