Henle vs. First Forum

[Naryee]

It would be fine to be finishing up grammar through 8th grade. In fact, we advocate teaching Latin to teach grammar as most kids developmentally are not ready to learn analytical grammar well prior to middle school. We are able to beat that timeline by studying Latin and tying in English grammar as we go.

Peace,
Paul

Thanks Paul.

[pschaeffer]

It would be fine to be finishing up grammar through 8th grade. In fact, we advocate teaching Latin to teach grammar as most kids developmentally are not ready to learn analytical grammar well prior to middle school. We are able to beat that timeline by studying Latin and tying in English grammar as we go.

Peace,
Paul

[Naryee]

Hi Naryee,

Henle goes through the grammar at twice the pace than Henle does. So while you are correct that there are no prerequisites for Henle, you just have to weigh whether he can take on that amount of information coming at him quickly. Since Latin is a language of stems and endings, I worry that since he isn't a good speller, he will have to work extra hard to be successful at Latin. A slower pace might be more ideal.

We have started offering Second Form Latin intensives in the summer, so if he does First Form this year and wants to continue through next summer, he could possibly wean the four years of the Form series down to three.

Peace,
Paul

For EGR, if my daughter starts in book 2 in 5th grade, if she does a book a year along side the Forums, that means she won’t be done with grammar until 8th grade. Is that okay? It’s seems late. She hasn’t had formal grammar instruction. What do you advise?

[Naryee]

You are right that a live teacher does make a world of difference! So here's my next idea: Have him choose 2 books from the 6th grade to read over the summer (that will give him a nice foundation in the Middle Ages in literature). Then you can do the 7th grade lit class in the fall and still be where you want to be.

Tanya

Ok. I will discuss this with my wife some more. We like your suggestions. Thanks for the suggestions.

[Naryee]

I just wanted to offer a suggestion, which may or may not work for you next year, but it's good for you to know anyway: there is a forum called Vita Beata for families using Memoria Press books. Vita Beata, gives the kids a forum to discuss once a week specific MP materials (like the 6th grade literature package, or Famous Men of Rome, for example), a forum that is moderated by a volunteer parent. It's not the equivalent of MPOA, but it still offers a form of class discussion. A lot of forums are full already for next year, but there are waiting lists. klwalukas is the mother behind it, in case you need more information.

This is amazing! Thank you for sharing. Most classes are full but this is great info. I will follow for the future.

[Mrs Bee]

That can work. If we do that, we would not be able to do MPOA which would aid with class discussion and by having a more experienced Lit teacher. But maybe that’s okay. I like your idea and he would like it too and will motivate him but I wonder if we are harming him/ slowing his progress by not having a robust discussion and teaching in plot development, literary analysis etc.

I just wanted to offer a suggestion, which may or may not work for you next year, but it's good for you to know anyway: there is a forum called Vita Beata for families using Memoria Press books. Vita Beata, gives the kids a forum to discuss once a week specific MP materials (like the 6th grade literature package, or Famous Men of Rome, for example), a forum that is moderated by a volunteer parent. It's not the equivalent of MPOA, but it still offers a form of class discussion. A lot of forums are full already for next year, but there are waiting lists. klwalukas is the mother behind it, in case you need more information.

[tanya]

You are right that a live teacher does make a world of difference! So here's my next idea: Have him choose 2 books from the 6th grade to read over the summer (that will give him a nice foundation in the Middle Ages in literature). Then you can do the 7th grade lit class in the fall and still be where you want to be.

Tanya

[Naryee]

Naryee,

What if you let him choose 4 books from 6th and 7th that he would like to study, so you have basically a combined year? And it gives him some choice. Then, when he is in 8th, you will be where you want to be. And you can buy individual lesson plans here to help you schedule your year: https://www.memoriapress.com/curricu...-lesson-plans/

Tanya

That can work. If we do that, we would not be able to do MPOA which would aid with class discussion and by having a more experienced Lit teacher. But maybe that’s okay. I like your idea and he would like it too and will motivate him but I wonder if we are harming him/ slowing his progress by not having a robust discussion and teaching in plot development, literary analysis etc.

[tanya]

Naryee,

What if you let him choose 4 books from 6th and 7th that he would like to study, so you have basically a combined year? And it gives him some choice. Then, when he is in 8th, you will be where you want to be. And you can buy individual lesson plans here to help you schedule your year: https://www.memoriapress.com/curricu...-lesson-plans/

Tanya

[Naryee]

Hello.

There isn't a big difference in difficulty level between 7th and 8th grade lit. The big step up is in 9th grade lit since it is medieval verse. So if you feel he would be ready to tackle that in 8th grade, you would be fine with moving him up. But you are right that those 7th grade lit books make a fun year!

Tanya

I have one more question. My other son will be 13 next week and we held him back in public school one year so he’s in 6th grade. He is however doing MP Lit 5 books. He did Lit 4 the year before. As I said in my original post, I want to skip 6th Lit to do 7th next year so that he could read Troy before he does the Iliad and Odyssey in his Classics I MPOA is taking this fall. I also want to bring him closer to where he should be in terms of reading level.

Would you suggest I go along with this? He would have to skip Robin Hood, King Arthur, Door in the Wall and Adam of the Road. I would like him to at least be in 9th grade Lit when he’s in 9th. What do you suggest? Skip or combine years? Skip 6th, 7th or 8th Lit? 8th Lit introduces American poetry a little more than prior grades so it seems this may not be the course to skip??? Or do you suggest just stay to course of where he is and skip/combine nothing?

We got him tested for disabilities. He has an average IQ and the team believes he can come up to grade level or pass with the right plan and help. He has emotional and self esteem issues. He is diligent somewhat (He gets up everyday on his own at 6am everyday to complete his school work early so he could be free. He only do what we want him to do. He will not do extra). He just needs to get better in doing things neat and taking his time.

We are working on fundamentals this year by doing:
Foundations of English, Middle School Comp I (MPOA) , FFL (thanks to everyone’s input), Classics I (MPOA), Math - Singapore 3A & 3B (Home), Literature course (Home or MPOA which would have a lot more discussion, dialog and structure), Spelling (VPOA - utilizes IEW phonic zoo). I think all this will ground him and tighten things up.

[Naryee]

Hello.

There isn't a big difference in difficulty level between 7th and 8th grade lit. The big step up is in 9th grade lit since it is medieval verse. So if you feel he would be ready to tackle that in 8th grade, you would be fine with moving him up. But you are right that those 7th grade lit books make a fun year!

Tanya

Thanks Tanya.

[tanya]

Hello.

There isn't a big difference in difficulty level between 7th and 8th grade lit. The big step up is in 9th grade lit since it is medieval verse. So if you feel he would be ready to tackle that in 8th grade, you would be fine with moving him up. But you are right that those 7th grade lit books make a fun year!

Tanya

[Naryee]

There are so many great Literature courses avaiible in the upper school. What do you think about one of my sons skipping 7th grade literature and going straight to 8th grade lit for 7th grade. He would then take 9th grade literature in the 8th grade. I have doubt he can do it and do it well but the 7th grade selection is exciting so I'm not sure about skipping these books. I could have him read Troy over the summer. If we do this, it will open up an extra year to take one more course in hs.

[Naryee]

Tanya,
Thanks for sharing that.

[pickandgrin]

Tanya,
I didn't know this twist in your son's story. How fun to know!