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    Pacing of Third Form

    My daughter will begin Third Form as a 6th grader in the fall. Since that is a little young (we're using the rest of 6M core), I'm happy to take our time with it and allow the material to really soak in. Any tips on how to schedule it? The lesson plans seems to move really fast and skip some of the workbook, which I'd rather not do. I'm not sure whether we should aim to complete it in a year and a half or take two full years, putting us right on track with core 8 when we get there.

    Also, how would this affect the NLE? She did Intro this year, and I'd like her to do level I next, but would that work if she's slightly less than halfway through TFL?

    Seems like others have taken more than one year to do TFL, so if you have any insights or helpful tips, that would be greatly appreciated! I'm a little nervous since it looks like a significant step up from SFL.
    2018/2019
    Dd 12: MP 7A and First Form Greek
    Ds 10: MP 5M
    Ds 5: MP K

    #2
    Re: Pacing of Third Form

    We have been doing TFL with my 8th grader this year. I don't remember the lesson plans skipping any of the workbook (there might have been a time or two where I just assumed it was a typo). We have sometimes just done odds or evens when there have been a lot of translations. We also do some orally. We only did Intro level NLE this year so that my daughter wouldn't have to do a lot of extra study for the test. If you really want her to take Level 1 next year, she would need to do extra study, or maybe take the NLE online class. That could fit into your planning if you do decide to spread it out, but then the following year I think it would be harder to continue moving on to Level 2, so at some point you might just need to have her skip NLE one year.

    Unless Latin is your child's favorite subject, I think it would be wise to spread it out over 2 years. There is a great deal of recitation time involved, not just the workbook. There is also just a lot of vocabulary that they have accumulated over the forms to review and make sure they are solid on, like making sure they really know the gender of their nouns, etc.

    All the best,
    Kristin
    Kristin - Administrator for Vita Beata (discussion classes for MP users)
    DD19; AFROTC and Aerospace Engineering Major
    DD16; Rising Senior!

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Pacing of Third Form

      This isn't about third from per se -- we're tackling that next year! -- but one thing that has worked for us is to do Latin year-round, each day doing one page of the workbook and our recitation/review. If there is a workbook page with a lot of translation sentences, we try to do a little each day.

      Just a thought. This is how I was planning to do 3rd Form until my child's grandmother offered to pay for the Online Academy classes in Latin.

      Also: there will be an Online Academy NLE prep course this year. If it is affordable, maybe this would be a nice scaffolding for test prep?
      Ana, mama to
      ds A, 14 yo
      ds N, 9 yo

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Pacing of Third Form

        Another up vote for year round Latin.
        Blessings,
        Jude

        DD 20, DS 17, DS 14, DS 12, DD 10, DS 7, DD 5
        DD 23 College grad, married, employed.
        DS 20 Autistic, beautiful, unemployable.
        DS 17 HS grad. Twelve years of MP. Hopes to be a chess-playing priest.
        DS 15 Teaching me to give up the reins. Does MP work when not in ballet classes, at rehearsals, stretching or playing chess.
        DD 13 Nine years of MP. Chess player, marksman, WSJ fan.
        DS 11 Six years of MP. Chess player, ballet dancer, archer.
        DD 8 Four years of MP. Chess player, occasional dancer. Actually gets to write in the Student Guides.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Pacing of Third Form

          Hi Angela,

          Many people do take more than a year to do TFL, especially when they are doing it below 7th grade. Typically we advise a comfortable pace that fosters mastery, so if they are not understanding something, slow it down and stay on it until the student has comprehended it. If it takes a year and a half, fine; if it takes two years, fine as well.

          As far as the NLE goes, your daughter should be fine to take Level 1.

          It is a step up from SFL, but take it a lesson at a time. You can do it.
          Jacob
          Memoria Press

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Pacing of Third Form

            Originally posted by serendipitous journey View Post
            This isn't about third from per se -- we're tackling that next year! -- but one thing that has worked for us is to do Latin year-round, each day doing one page of the workbook and our recitation/review. If there is a workbook page with a lot of translation sentences, we try to do a little each day.

            Just a thought. This is how I was planning to do 3rd Form until my child's grandmother offered to pay for the Online Academy classes in Latin.

            Also: there will be an Online Academy NLE prep course this year. If it is affordable, maybe this would be a nice scaffolding for test prep?
            Doing 1 page a day in 3rd form would be about 250 school days if you don't count the written drill page that is done on a separate sheet of paper in each lesson (if you count those, it would be another 36 pages). Then add in 37 test days, for 287 school days, which if done 5 days a week would be over 57 weeks.
            Kristin - Administrator for Vita Beata (discussion classes for MP users)
            DD19; AFROTC and Aerospace Engineering Major
            DD16; Rising Senior!

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Pacing of Third Form

              Originally posted by Angela View Post
              My daughter will begin Third Form as a 6th grader in the fall. Since that is a little young (we're using the rest of 6M core), I'm happy to take our time with it and allow the material to really soak in. Any tips on how to schedule it? The lesson plans seems to move really fast and skip some of the workbook, which I'd rather not do. I'm not sure whether we should aim to complete it in a year and a half or take two full years, putting us right on track with core 8 when we get there.

              Also, how would this affect the NLE? She did Intro this year, and I'd like her to do level I next, but would that work if she's slightly less than halfway through TFL?

              Seems like others have taken more than one year to do TFL, so if you have any insights or helpful tips, that would be greatly appreciated! I'm a little nervous since it looks like a significant step up from SFL.
              Hi Angela,

              I don't know if this helps, but we've just started Third Form Latin after finishing 6M. Many folks have posted that TFL is the most difficult of the 4 forms so we're starting now and going slowly all summer except for trips. If your daughter is rattling off the grammar forms with ease, you can always speed up later. God bless! -Pam
              DS15, MPOA HS Comp III & Material Logic, mostly MP with substitutions 2020-2021

              "[May] the peace of God, which passes all understanding, ... keep your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus."

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Pacing of Third Form

                My oldest did third form with the online academy this year and I made him do all the workbook work. There were some weeks where not every page was assigned in the plans, so I just penciled in the extra while trying to spread the load evenly across five days of work. By the end of the year he was doing more work on a few days and just review (and online quiz) on academy day. It's definitely an uptick in work, but it seems to come at just the right time. He's excited about fourth form this fall to "learn how to do the rest of the things they've not taught me yet." I love that he's become aware of the remaining gaps between what we can make language do in English and what he doesn't know how to do in Latin.

                Now that he's conquered it I'm less afraid myself. Working through second form (again) and eager to take new territory.

                Oh, you asked about NLE. He took Level 1 this year and did very well with only the MP guide and old NLE exams for preparation. There was only one verb he didn't know and he guessed correctly by ruling out the other three options (based on grammar).
                Festina lentē,
                Jessica P

                2020-2021
                11th year HSing · 9th year MP
                @ Home, HLN, & Latin online
                11th, 9th, 6th, 3rd

                Highlands Latin Nashville Cottage School

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Pacing of Third Form

                  Originally posted by klwalukas View Post
                  Doing 1 page a day in 3rd form would be about 250 school days if you don't count the written drill page that is done on a separate sheet of paper in each lesson (if you count those, it would be another 36 pages). Then add in 37 test days, for 287 school days, which if done 5 days a week would be over 57 weeks.
                  Yep! This would be a over a year for third form. We do Latin 6 days/week here, but at the 5-day pace you laid out, it could be done in one 36-week school year flanked by 2 11-week summers.
                  Ana, mama to
                  ds A, 14 yo
                  ds N, 9 yo

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Pacing of Third Form

                    My dyslexic 7th grader did just fine in TFL the first half of the year. It was more work but she did it just fine. But the second half was just too much for her. She simply could not keep up with all the new vocabulary and abstract grammar. The big increase in workbook load after first semester scared her. All those pages of translations was too much for her face alone. She sensed she was just getting by and not actually mastering it. She asked to slow down. We dropped down to about a lesson every 1 1/2 weeks meaning it took us 3 weeks to cover 2 weeks of lesson plans. We still drilled flashcards daily and did other drills daily and we did workbook pages daily- more than one a day. It still took us 7 days to do a lesson rather than 5. We are midway through subjunctive mood right now. She got very overwhelmed with pronouns but made it through. She is grasping subjuntive just fine, but struggling with the new vocabulary since many don't have simply English derivatives to relate to. We are still going at the week and half pace. Once we finish this unit there is only one unit left. Looking ahead at it, it seems to lighten up a bit. I think that unit we can go back to a lesson a week. If we work all summer we can finish before 8th grade starts- just barely. If we had kept pace with the lesson plans I KNOW she would not have mastered it. But she is not a typical student. She is VERY bright, but struggles mildly with verbal language.
                    Debbie- mom of 7, civil engineering grad, married to mechanical engineer
                    DD, 25, BFA '17 graphic design and illustration
                    DS, 23, BS '18 mechanical engineering
                    DS, 21, chemistry major
                    DS, 18, Physics major
                    DD, 15, dyslexic, 10th grade customizednMP plus co-op
                    DS, 12, super squirmy, possible dysgraphia, MP 7A
                    DD, 6 , K- finally one who seems to like drawing and writing- first one since my oldest!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Pacing of Third Form

                      Originally posted by klwalukas View Post
                      Doing 1 page a day in 3rd form would be about 250 school days if you don't count the written drill page that is done on a separate sheet of paper in each lesson (if you count those, it would be another 36 pages). Then add in 37 test days, for 287 school days, which if done 5 days a week would be over 57 weeks.
                      Thanks for breaking it down like this for me. I think we will likely do something closer to a page a day than what the lesson plans have scheduled since she is only in 6th grade. Wow- 57 weeks is a long time!
                      2018/2019
                      Dd 12: MP 7A and First Form Greek
                      Ds 10: MP 5M
                      Ds 5: MP K

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Pacing of Third Form

                        Originally posted by momgineer View Post
                        My dyslexic 7th grader did just fine in TFL the first half of the year. It was more work but she did it just fine. But the second half was just too much for her. She simply could not keep up with all the new vocabulary and abstract grammar. The big increase in workbook load after first semester scared her. All those pages of translations was too much for her face alone. She sensed she was just getting by and not actually mastering it. She asked to slow down. We dropped down to about a lesson every 1 1/2 weeks meaning it took us 3 weeks to cover 2 weeks of lesson plans. We still drilled flashcards daily and did other drills daily and we did workbook pages daily- more than one a day. It still took us 7 days to do a lesson rather than 5. We are midway through subjunctive mood right now. She got very overwhelmed with pronouns but made it through. She is grasping subjuntive just fine, but struggling with the new vocabulary since many don't have simply English derivatives to relate to. We are still going at the week and half pace. Once we finish this unit there is only one unit left. Looking ahead at it, it seems to lighten up a bit. I think that unit we can go back to a lesson a week. If we work all summer we can finish before 8th grade starts- just barely. If we had kept pace with the lesson plans I KNOW she would not have mastered it. But she is not a typical student. She is VERY bright, but struggles mildly with verbal language.
                        Thanks so much for sharing this, Debibie! I'm trying to work through the lessons myself in advance, and I'm already overwhelmed way before the second half of the book ! That's great that you were able to tailor the pace so nicely to match your daughter's needs.
                        2018/2019
                        Dd 12: MP 7A and First Form Greek
                        Ds 10: MP 5M
                        Ds 5: MP K

                        Comment

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