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Cc fable----help!

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    #16
    Re: Cc fable----help!

    Thanks, Cindy! When I saw who the last post was, I was so confused to see you on this thread - but thanks for the note!

    OT....just got a card from U of I.....they are honoring one of my old profs....times like these make it so hard to be so far from central I. Wanna go for me???

    AMDG,
    Sarah
    2020-2021
    16th Year HSing; 10th Year with MP
    DD, 19, Homeschool grad; college sophomore
    DS, 16
    DD, 14
    DD, 12
    DD, 10
    DD, 8
    DD, 6
    +DS+
    DS, 2

    Comment


      #17
      Re: Cc fable----help!

      Sarah thank you for taking the time to right that out! It's helpful as we start back up to see this overview.
      -Amy

      Nine babies, 6 graduated, 5 married, 17 grand babies 7 and under!
      2020/21 MP 3rd, 6th, 11th MPOA, College student. Starting 8th year using Memoria Press
      Director of Coop 412, a Classical Christian Coop using MP and based on Ephesians 4:12.

      Comment


        #18
        Re: Cc fable----help!

        Two practical notes:
        I would add that when you have your children write their paraphrases, have them skip a line in between their writing lines. It looks cleaner and makes it easier to correct . Someone gave that suggestion last year on the forum and we began doing that mid year in Narrative: it made such a difference. My son didn't want to at first, but then after the first couple, even he appreciated the cleanliness/neatness factor--and it helped him speedily do his final drafts as well.

        The question about the paragraphs is tricky sometimes with the Fables and even the Narratives. When you read the original fable you will notice that sometimes there are not a lot of paragraphs--sometimes none at all. So again, at this point there should not be too much stress on the parsing out of paragraphs unless you see clear places for them--otherwise there is freedom to stick to the flow of the original narrative--or at least within the outline blocks. I will repeat that these paraphrases are going to appear very similar to the originals, with the addition of a few creative descriptions, and that is perfectly terrific, bc that is the point! Can you retell this story, not miss any major details, form solid sentences, spell correctly, and use good handwriting? Great! Going from Oral retelling to Mom to independently doing most of the work by at least sometime in 2nd half of the course--(earlier for others, surely)--awesome! That is the foundation we are laying here in 4th grade and just by using the original text they pick up what constitutes "good" writing.

        I love that Sarah and I are encouraging others to see how this course can be started slowly with what is independently expected of the child and to gradually see the progression in confidence and skill as the weeks go by. The LP and TM look intimidating on paper as you do not immediately recognize how to implement what is being asked. I imagine that in the classroom with more experienced teachers it is being done in much the same manner at the beginning, with the end goals in sight, and a leading by the teachers toward those. These are simple, lovely tales that delight and lend themselves easily to retelling and rewriting. Thank goodness! Children can't be expected to do what they don't know how to do. That is exactly what I detested in other writing programs. I knew in my gut there had to be a more systematic way to go about it--of course leave it to the ancients and MP to figure out how to bring it current to classical education. The daily work is hard and repetitive, and there will be weeks where you will need to allow more time to get the work accomplished--but by and by, it does begin to click and the child really does gain a great deal of confidence by the end. For us, Fable definitely laid the ground work for Narrative, and now just beginning our school year I am so excited to see the Chreia/Maxim and to now begin Fable with my 4th grader.

        Elizabeth
        Elizabeth
        Currently using 6A (DS 11), 4A (DD 9), 2 (DS 7), and Jr.K (DS almost 5)

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          #19
          Re: Cc fable----help!

          Elizabeth,
          I am in your same spot....getting to start over on Fable (so being at the beginning) and to be heading into Chreia/Maxim. I got to chat with Brett Vaden at Sodalitas - I have gotten to snag him each year to get the "main idea" of each new level. I was thinking Chreia was going to be about helping our children understand/work with pithy sayings, just from the title. I don't know why they would need a year on that, but I honestly had not looked at it too closely.

          But in talking with him, I discovered we are learning how to write eight different types of paragraphs, each one with a different purpose/way of supporting or explaining the saying. These paragraphs/methods of support can then be combined to make any length of "essay" a child would need to wrtiite. Ahha! So the work kids do in the first two levels to learn how to structure thought simply, then now, they are going to see the different types of argument/explanation. I am so excited! I am not expecting easy, but it will certainly be interesting and rewarding! We are still in review weeks, so we have not gotten to new material yet. Hope you guys have a great year with it!

          AMDG,
          Sarah
          2020-2021
          16th Year HSing; 10th Year with MP
          DD, 19, Homeschool grad; college sophomore
          DS, 16
          DD, 14
          DD, 12
          DD, 10
          DD, 8
          DD, 6
          +DS+
          DS, 2

          Comment


            #20
            Re: Cc fable----help!

            I could have written the original post myself. I appreciate the feedback that has followed, the ideas have helped some.

            We are now at Week 11 and neither of us feel we have a firm grasp of the material, so naturally tears and frustration ensue. When we began I didn't realize DVD's were available for this course. I was hoping someone could provide me a little more insight as to if they are helpful. The clip on the MP website really doesn't highlight what I consider to be the more difficult aspects to teach: outlining, figures of description, and my daughter's least favorite, Paraphrase 2.

            My daughter is resistant to the idea of DVD's being a writing phobic. I am considering adding them because I don't feel like our current balance with me instructing is helpful either. Sometimes I feel like I just write for her! This is a bit of an overstatement but I do wonder how much of the ideas, writing should be self-led, and how much "scaffolding" I should be providing. I don't think we have a very good balance.

            A rambling Saturday morning post... any insight would be helpful.
            Natalie

            DD, age 13: CC 7M, with a few swaps
            DD, age 10: CC 5M
            Third year using full MP CC, Forth year homeschooling

            Comment


              #21
              Re: Cc fable----help!

              Originally posted by Natalie0411 View Post
              I could have written the original post myself. I appreciate the feedback that has followed, the ideas have helped some.

              We are now at Week 11 and neither of us feel we have a firm grasp of the material, so naturally tears and frustration ensue. When we began I didn't realize DVD's were available for this course. I was hoping someone could provide me a little more insight as to if they are helpful. The clip on the MP website really doesn't highlight what I consider to be the more difficult aspects to teach: outlining, figures of description, and my daughter's least favorite, Paraphrase 2.

              My daughter is resistant to the idea of DVD's being a writing phobic. I am considering adding them because I don't feel like our current balance with me instructing is helpful either. Sometimes I feel like I just write for her! This is a bit of an overstatement but I do wonder how much of the ideas, writing should be self-led, and how much "scaffolding" I should be providing. I don't think we have a very good balance.

              A rambling Saturday morning post... any insight would be helpful.
              The DVD clip online does not show the entire lesson, just a part of it...I am pretty sure he goes over every part of the lesson on the DVD...We are not at lesson 11 yet, but for the earlier lessons he goes over the different parts...Someone will have to chime in if it changes somewhere down the road...

              The DVDs are a must have for me...It was really difficult for me to understand what to do without them...I would suggest getting them if you can...
              Tahara

              Homeschooling two boys
              DS -19 (9/00) Homeschool graduate, in college
              DS -15 (9/04) (SN) MP Year 8 w/ FF Latin
              DS -14 (7/06) MP Year 8 w/ FF Latin

              Comment


                #22
                Re: Cc fable----help!

                I personally do not have the DVDs, so I cannot say whether they would help your specific need, but I am confident they are really good. The teacher on them is excellent! (Hi Brett!). I always pick his brain when we are starting a new level, and he is really helpful.

                For now, I will suggest a couple of things. First, week 11 is really not that far in with a young student. And I mean young only because we are not talking about an upper school child. You have really only done each exercise five or six times, since each lesson takes two weeks. I would first of all be patient. Very patient. The skills grow quietly, taking time to sink in. I would not be panicking yet, even though you are still doing a lot of guiding and helping. As long as your child is following along, and trying, there is still learning taking place.

                Second, keep in mind that children always have different strengths and weaknesses. The parts one of my children dreaded, would be another child's favorite part. Kind of like how some of them love green beans, and some of them hate them. They are still good for them, and they still have to eat them.

                We tend to get tears when someone encounters something new, because they are frustrated that they don't already know how to do it, or do not feel good at it yet. For me, it is like water off a duck's back. I stay calm, let the moment pass, and remind them that new skills take practice to become old habits. It will not always feel strange. We were in a martial arts studio once which had this saying on the wall: "frustration is a sign you are about to have a break-through." I thought that was a great way to look at it!

                So keep helping, maybe trying to offer silly, off-the-wall examples to add some levity...that seems to help me. If you want specific pointers on those sections, we can offer that sort of help too!

                AMDG,
                Sarah
                2020-2021
                16th Year HSing; 10th Year with MP
                DD, 19, Homeschool grad; college sophomore
                DS, 16
                DD, 14
                DD, 12
                DD, 10
                DD, 8
                DD, 6
                +DS+
                DS, 2

                Comment


                  #23
                  Re: Cc fable----help!

                  Hello.

                  I can get you a link to the first lesson in its entirety of that would help you. But I also want to say that the modeling you are doing, working with your student, is fine. When we start the Fable stage at our school, the class does the lessons together - with the teacher writing the students' oral responses on the board. Then, everyone copies the outline or paraphrase together. This is necessary, especially for younger students.

                  Just send me an email, and I'll send you the link to the Fable lesson. I'm working on getting it uploaded today.

                  Tanya
                  tanya@memoriapress.com

                  Comment


                    #24
                    Re: Cc fable----help!

                    The DVDs were a life saver for me last year. I had a baby in the fall, and the DVDs helped my very independent son just go with the program. I was so grateful for them. They are very well done and he enjoyed them.

                    This year I chose to utilize the online classes and actually had him do the fable/narrative combination. I'm so grateful I did that as well, because I'm comparing his fables from this year to last year and there is a lightspeed of difference. I am so happy to have someone else grading the papers and giving feedback. I have also had the benefit of hearing the teacher explain how what is being learned now will be incorporated in the Cheria/Maxim stage and am so thankful I chose this program.

                    I do love IEW as well, but I vote for sticking with CC. I see the progymnasmata as a complete sequential program that is well worth trudging through.
                    Christina

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