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Private teacher looking to place Latin students for next year

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  • Jen (formerly) in Japan
    replied
    Charity, even before you put your kids through a 4-6 page test, maybe you can ascertain the answer by asking the following question:

    Have the students MASTERED all 5 noun declensions? The first two verb conjugations? 1st/2nd Declension Adjectives? Don't even worry about vocab for now. However, Second Form Day 1 begins with the assumption that the student can recite all 5 noun declensions instant-recall fast.

    I think you should focus on the answer to this question because very few beginner Latin programs cover all 5 declensions.


    Editing to add more...

    I realize a little context to my comments might help.

    I've mentioned several times this spring that I just spent the last school year teaching Latin at a classical academy which caters to homeschoolers. Not sure if this came though, but I transitioning the academy to MP Latin curricula from the previous immersion curriculum they had been using with an "expert" (Cambridge Latin, to be exact).

    So, my "Latin 2" students were placed into Second Form.

    Honestly? It was a disaster. I am *quite* certain they _recognized_ Latin stems and endings. However, they had not MASTERED the endings. They could not instantly recall any declension past the 2nd and only the 1st conjugation. I will tell you that Second Form begins with a massive overview of all nouns, endings and vocabulary both, from First Form but there would be no earthly way the students can "master" (instant recall) all 5 declensions in a one week review.

    Basically, all my Latin 2 kids relied on cramming for the weekly quiz, Hail Mary'ed the unit tests, and decided not to continue with Latin after Second Form.



    All people love what they have mastered. Just being able to "recognize" the endings won't be sufficient to have a good productive year with Second Form as I can attest to first hand.




    Jen
    Last edited by Jen (formerly) in Japan; 05-19-2014, 08:41 AM.

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  • tanya
    replied
    Charity,

    Your placement test for First Form could be the First Form Latin final exam. That would be a great way to see if students have mastered the grammar forms that are taught in FFL.

    Tanya

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  • charitydotson
    replied
    Hi Paul!

    It would be really great to get a placement test for first form. technically all students from grade 3+ are learning Latin (not-curriculum based) so I can easily see how there would be a lot of possibilities for levels by grade 6/7.

    Leave a comment:


  • pschaeffer
    replied
    As Jen mentioned they will most likely have to start with First Form due to the grammar forms and vocabulary. However, a placement test can't hurt. We suggest using the final exam from the previous Form book. So to see if they would do well in Second Form, give them the exam at the end of First Form. If you don't have that exam on hand, we should be able to provide that for you.

    Paul

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  • SaintJude7
    replied
    You rock!

    Excellent answer, Jen. Clicked on that question last night, but couldn't think how to explain exactly why she should start with First Form. Someone should put that explanation on a sticky. (I'm hoping one day they will put a sticky thread called "If You're Thinking of Skipping Kindergarten.")
    Blessings,
    Jude

    dd 17
    ds (14)
    ds 11
    ds 9
    dd 7
    ds 4
    dd 2

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  • Jen (formerly) in Japan
    replied
    Charity,

    I don't think there is any way around this: even with some "immersion" background, everyone must begin with First Form Latin. See, the Forms are quite literally the entire Latin grammar book laid out sequentially, slowly building a firm retention of Latin stems and endings. First Form contains all FIVE noun declensions. The subsequent forms never reteach nouns; they only practice them. (First Form contains more than 5 noun declensions, I just use that as a critical example). Each Form tackles a different section of "The Latin Grammar Book", such that by the end of the Fourth Form, a Latin student has theoretically mastered all of Latin grammar. After the Forms, it's practice, vocab, practice, translation, repeat. After the Forms, a student practices the *use* of Latin, but only refreshes the grammar of Latin.

    Does that make sense? I can continue to explain the genius of the Forms if you'd like.


    Jen


    PS: Do you understand what I mean by "the Latin grammar"? If you look at the Henle package on MP's website, you will see a book called "Grammar". It's like a handbook that works through each part of speech and how Latin does the endings (simplifying here; look at the samples). The Forms "deconstruct" that Grammar book so that the student masters each part of speech. Vocabulary is acquired along the way in the Forms, but it is not the emphasis. After the Forms are mastered, the student simply continues to acquire vocabulary and moves into translation and usage.

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  • Private teacher looking to place Latin students for next year

    Hi there! As some of you may know I was a public school HS teacher this last year homeschooling my daughter classically. Since then, I've gotten a job for next year at a classical academy and looking to switch from the current system (essentially a hodgepodge of Prentice materials) to a streamlined curriculum. The kids have learned Latin for at least one year now, but since they haven't been following a curriculum, I'm not entirely sure where to start them (it's a 6/7 split self-contained classroom). Does Memoria Press have a "placement test" I can administer at the beginning of the year or that I can have the current 4/5 teacher administer tto upcoming 6/7s? The last teacher was "fluent" and had a total emersion classroom where they spoke only Latin during that one hour of the day so I really have no way to guage the level any other way.

    Thanks!
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