Henle after Third Form??

[Bonnie]

Tara, as excited as I am at the thought of your students actually reading Caesar (!), I defer to Jon's well-considered advice for the path forward. I do think your boys will like Henle I, and you can always get help with Henle on the Forum.

Bonnie

[Bonnie]

The new guide covers the 32 lessons (which incorporate relevant material from the Henle Grammar). There are additional explanations about grammatical constructions and all the concepts studied. We continually work on understanding Latin word order and using tools for better reading and comprehending Latin as Latin, before translating into English. There are guide instructions for each day. There are regular tests and a comprehensive final. While parents are welcome to learn with the student, the guide is written so that parents can administer tests and monitor progress while letting the student work independently.

I added more background information for Fr. Henle's many reading passages to clarify how they help in understanding Roman history and the Gallic War. Then in the final weeks, students read passages from Caesar's Gallic War. (These are passages that are not on the AP Latin Exam. AP selections are studied the following year.) Henle's version of The Gallic War is modified to be easier at the beginning and gradually transitions so that the student is reading authentic Caesar passages in the final weeks. At year-end they will be prepared to continue with a deeper study of the Gallic War and the AP-assigned Caesar passages the following year.

There are also notes for better understanding the Christian Latin selections in Henle II.

Bonnie

[TaraT]

The new guide covers the 32 lessons (which incorporate relevant material from the Henle Grammar). There are additional explanations about grammatical constructions and all the concepts studied. We continually work on understanding Latin word order and using tools for better reading and comprehending Latin as Latin, before translating into English. There are guide instructions for each day. There are regular tests and a comprehensive final. While parents are welcome to learn with the student, the guide is written so that parents can administer tests and monitor progress while letting the student work independently.

I added more background information for Fr. Henle's many reading passages to clarify how they help in understanding Roman history and the Gallic War. Then in the final weeks, students read passages from Caesar's Gallic War. (These are passages that are not on the AP Latin Exam. AP selections are studied the following year.) Henle's version of The Gallic War is modified to be easier at the beginning and gradually transitions so that the student is reading authentic Caesar passages in the final weeks. At year-end they will be prepared to continue with a deeper study of the Gallic War and the AP-assigned Caesar passages the following year.

There are also notes for better understanding the Christian Latin selections in Henle II.

Bonnie

Wow! I feel so honored! :-) I got the cream of crop commenting on my question.♥️ Thank you all for your time and consideration.

So it sounds like either 4F or Henle I 6-14. What to choose?🤔 So with the Henle I, are there any kind of lesson plans that my boys could follow? I love the simplicity of MP lesson plans and how they keep everyone on track👏


****Well now that I actually look at the Henle guide I see that there appear to be lesson plans in them! :-)

[hermione310]

The new guide covers the 32 lessons (which incorporate relevant material from the Henle Grammar). There are additional explanations about grammatical constructions and all the concepts studied. We continually work on understanding Latin word order and using tools for better reading and comprehending Latin as Latin, before translating into English. There are guide instructions for each day. There are regular tests and a comprehensive final. While parents are welcome to learn with the student, the guide is written so that parents can administer tests and monitor progress while letting the student work independently.

I added more background information for Fr. Henle's many reading passages to clarify how they help in understanding Roman history and the Gallic War. Then in the final weeks, students read passages from Caesar's Gallic War. (These are passages that are not on the AP Latin Exam. AP selections are studied the following year.) Henle's version of The Gallic War is modified to be easier at the beginning and gradually transitions so that the student is reading authentic Caesar passages in the final weeks. At year-end they will be prepared to continue with a deeper study of the Gallic War and the AP-assigned Caesar passages the following year.

There are also notes for better understanding the Christian Latin selections in Henle II.

Bonnie

I am thrilled to hear this!

We have been with MP Latin since Prima. This year we are tackling Fourth Form, and with Henle II on the horizon, I did not feel equipped to teach this at home. I’ve been so spoiled by MP’s rich guides and excellent lesson plans, and felt like I’d need more than what’s currently available, particularly without the video instruction we’ve used each year (hint - if this is possible for Henle II, we’d love that too….).

I actually signed my daughter up with an outside provider for an online Latin class to follow Fourth Form, however, she has not wanted to go this route as MP had worked so well for us and as year-round homeschoolers, fitting into a standard semester schedule is difficult. We nixed that plan and decided to press on with the existing Henle II guide, but I’ve been feeling anxious about tackling this. Knowing more instruction is coming, and just in the nick of time, is the best news I’ve heard this week! Thank you once again, MP.

Please know that there are long-time MP users out there that would love to go the distance with MP materials at home through high school. MPOA is an excellent resource, but not a fit/option for all of us. Thanks again.

[Jen_NH]

I am very excited about these updates. My older son is in 4FL this year and will be in Henle II next year. These are very welcome changes.

[Bonnie]

Hermione,

I am very glad that you are sticking with MP Latin. The Henle II year is a great year in learning to read and comprehend Latin and how to translate Latin into English. It leads the student directly into reading Caesar -- which is the best way to prepare to read other Roman authors. Fr. Henle wrote superb textbooks and an excellent grammar book. If you have any questions at all about anything in the Henle II year, including grading the tests, just ask on the Forum. I hope we will have some great conversations about Latin.

Bonnie

[Mom2mthj]

I can’t wait to see the new plans. My eighth grader is working his way through third form so I don’t know when we will get there, but I am glad to see there will be great resources available for study at home.

[Mom2mthj]

Any update on whether we will be able to look at the new Henle 2 plans will be available at Sodalitas? I am still very confused after looking at the way the author expected the book to be used (maybe only completing through unit 7 in henle 1 before moving on to Henle 2) why the current henle 2 plans take all year and still don’t appear to cover any of the Caesar translations despite a base assumption of the student having completed fourth form (grammar content greater than all of Henle 1)? I was told at one point that it was teacher vs. no teacher, but I was disappointed that my daughter’s MPOA class a few years back didn’t cover much new material either. Now I see that MPOA now has two levels of Henle 2 classes so now I am even less sure how the home plans and the classes will line up.

[tanya]

Hello.

I am attaching a sample lesson for you here: Henle Second Year Sample Lesson.pdf

This has not been proofed, and it could change, but it should give you a good idea of what the new plans will look like.

As far as the material covered, at HLS we used to cover all of Henle 2 in a year, but Cheryl Lowe determined that the students weren't as grounded in the grammar as they should have been at the end of that process. So she convinced our Latin head that we needed to have one more year of grammar to prepare students to read Caesar, and then they would be better translators and it would be the best use of everyone's time. This has worked very well for us, and I remember the year all of our students made 5's on the AP Latin exam when the Latin head said that Cheryl was correct, and we had succeeded in turning our students into translators.

That's a long history, but our decisions are usually based on actual experience in the classroom, and you have been patient to ride along with us as we swerve around, trying to perfect our students' experience and foster as much success as possible in the time we have with them!

Tanya

[Mrs Bee]

Any update on whether we will be able to look at the new Henle 2 plans will be available at Sodalitas? I am still very confused after looking at the way the author expected the book to be used (maybe only completing through unit 7 in henle 1 before moving on to Henle 2) why the current henle 2 plans take all year and still don’t appear to cover any of the Caesar translations despite a base assumption of the student having completed fourth form (grammar content greater than all of Henle 1)? I was told at one point that it was teacher vs. no teacher, but I was disappointed that my daughter’s MPOA class a few years back didn’t cover much new material either. Now I see that MPOA now has two levels of Henle 2 classes so now I am even less sure how the home plans and the classes will line up.

Dorinda, back in February there was this post in the Academy forum that explained both the evolution of the Henle II MPOA class and what the target is for the new Henle II Exercises class. It doesn't answer your question about plans for home, but I thought it may be a good idea to reference that post here.

[hermione310]

Hello.

I am attaching a sample lesson for you here: [ATTACH]n135802[/ATTACH]

This has not been proofed, and it could change, but it should give you a good idea of what the new plans will look like.

As far as the material covered, at HLS we used to cover all of Henle 2 in a year, but Cheryl Lowe determined that the students weren't as grounded in the grammar as they should have been at the end of that process. So she convinced our Latin head that we needed to have one more year of grammar to prepare students to read Caesar, and then they would be better translators and it would be the best use of everyone's time. This has worked very well for us, and I remember the year all of our students made 5's on the AP Latin exam when the Latin head said that Cheryl was correct, and we had succeeded in turning our students into translators.

That's a long history, but our decisions are usually based on actual experience in the classroom, and you have been patient to ride along with us as we swerve around, trying to perfect our students' experience and foster as much success as possible in the time we have with them!

Tanya

Thank you so much for posting the sample! I’m excited to look at it today.

Is this expected to be ready for sale by the end of the summer? DD is wrapping up 4th Form and the plan has been to do the updated Henle II in lieu of an online class. If it may be delayed I’ll need to sign her up for an online class (although I’d rather not) as I don’t feel confident to teach the existing Henle II at home.

Apologies for asking this question over and over. Just don’t want to miss the window if we need to switch gears and do online after all.

thank you for all you do for the kids!

[Bonnie]

Regarding the sample which covers Lesson 1, I just wanted to add that, prior to starting the Henle lessons, the new guide has five days of preparatory work. This week includes a review (with quizzes) on more than 100 words constantly used by Caesar (all of which would have been learned in Henle I and the Forms). Students also study supplemental papers in which I review pronunciation and also discuss Latin word order and how to approach reading Latin. (Word order is a major concern for many students at this point in learning to read Latin, so we constantly discuss word order in the lessons and the readings.) There are instructions/advice on getting the most out of each Henle lesson. There is also a note to parents as to how the guide and test book should be used. So the student and parent are not coming cold into the lessons.

I don't know whether this info will help anyone, but it might: In the new homeschool student plans, after doing the 32 lessons, in the final 40 days of the year, students do begin reading the modified Henle passages from Caesar's Gallic War. Henle's modifications taper off so that, by the end of the school year, students are reading authentic Caesar. I stopped at the point where the AP Caesar readings begin -- which will be studied the following year. (The AP-assigned Caesar readings are only a portion of Caesar's complete book.) There are also some reading passages on the Civil War and on the assassination of Caesar.

I will also add that I wrote very thorough tests for the lessons (16 tests as I recall and a two-part final exam) which should give the parent an accurate indicator of how the student is progressing during the year. The tests focus on reading Latin sentences and passages and on recognizing grammatical constructions, as well as understanding the historical information in the lessons (which helps them put Caesar's Gallic War in historical context). I think students will find the tests interesting and a learning experience in themselves.

Bonnie

[tanya]

Thank you, Bonnie, for filling in the gaps! I didn't even mention that this is your baby.

I actually have a question after looking over the guide yesterday, so I'll just ask it here. If people can't get everything you have assigned done in the days as you have scheduled them, can the material at the end of the year be skipped and they will still be able to move forward? (i.e., If all they can get done is the 32 lessons, is that sufficient?) I ask because this looks like a lot of material each day, and I'm afraid people will get behind and not know what to do! Or, should they get what they can do completed each day and move on to the next day even if they can't cover it all?

Tanya

[tanya]

Dorinda,

We are in the editing stage now, so having the guide by the end of summer shouldn't be a problem. EXCEPT: We are really struggling with our printers right now. It is taking at least 8 weeks to get any of our books printed. This is causing serious problems for our inventory. Worst case scenario though would be that you email me and beg for an in-house printed book if they are stuck at the printers because of the paper shortage.

Tanya

[Jen_NH]

If the guide isn't available due to printing issues, it possible to have it as a digital download? I would pay for it in that format, esp. if it would otherwise be unavailable.