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    US history before European?

    For various reasons I am considering an arrangement that would place a year of American history (MPOA's combined year) in 10th before doing AP European in 11th, and I wonder if I'm guilty of heresy and blasphemy I know HLS years and years ago used to do 2 years of American in 9th-10th followed by 2 years of European, so it can't be a mortal sin, perhaps just a very bad venial one, from which the kids will recover all right?

    DS (15)
    DD (14)
    DS (7)

    #2
    Following along ....

    I was planning on Medieval History next year in 10th, then Euro in 11th and US History in 12th. 🤔
    Plans for 2021-22

    Year 11 of homeschooling with MP

    DD1 - 26 - Small Business owner with 2 locations
    DD2 - 15 - 10th grade - HLS Cottage School/MPOA/True North Academy - equestrian
    DS3 - 13 -6A Cottage School - soccer/tennis -dyslexia and dysgraphia
    DS4 - 13 - 6A Cottage School -soccer -auditory processing disorder
    DD5 - 9 - 4A, Cottage School -equestrian
    DS6 - 7 - MP 1 - first time at the Cottage School this fall!

    Comment


      #3
      That's a good sequence, DiannaKennedy - in my case I just wonder about placing American before modern European... I have several goals/needs that would make it convenient to reverse the usual order, I just don't know if I should really do it. E.g., I would really prefer not to have a big history course in 12th, especially US, since I would prefer the kids did Government/Economics/Political Philosophy after a US history course, not at the same time. We will need one AP history class, but I don't want to do it in 10th grade, so that leaves me with 11th. I am totally burned out right now and I'm afraid I wouldn't do a good job at home supporting the one-year plan compressing Palmer's European history - if MPOA offered that, I'd have signed them up already... in the end I may choose this route anyway, which was my plan until quite recently.
      DS (15)
      DD (14)
      DS (7)

      Comment


        #4
        Maybe I was not clear - I'd like those semester classes (Government, etc.) to be done after both European and US history, so it wouldn't work to do European for 2 years, then US in 12th with all those semester classes at the same time. I really prize those 3 classes, and they would be our "social studies" (how much I dislike the phrase!) for 12th grade on their own.
        DS (15)
        DD (14)
        DS (7)

        Comment


          #5
          I don't think it matters what order you do high school history in. Our students are well-educated and perfectly capable of navigating between time periods without confusion, right? I think we place too much emphasis on chronology from year to year in classical education. Just put up a timeline to give students the context of the events they are studying, and you are good to go!

          Stepping off my soapbox now.
          ​​​​​

          Tanya

          Comment


            #6
            I got tanya's blessing! Yes, MP likes to de-emphasize the chronological imperative - I think the argument in the K-8 years is compelling. On the other hand, some things in history happened, and happened a certain way, because others had happened before, and shaped the political landscape a certain way. That's why I wanted to do Medieval right after Roman history, to make clear how we go from Rome to the beginnings of the European modern states, how that happened - I think that transition is tricky to understand, even discounting all the bad popular misconceptions about the Middle Ages.
            But I guess I should be confident that a US history book would not be a narration in a vacuum. And after all, the Founders were looking at Greece and Rome as their models, so that will be interesting. I told the kids we will simply sail with Columbus at the end of our Medieval studies, and stay in America for a while.
            DS (15)
            DD (14)
            DS (7)

            Comment


              #7
              "I told the kids we will simply sail with Columbus at the end of our Medieval studies, and stay in America for a while."

              I love this! 💕

              Comment


                #8
                Just to add a different piece to this discussion, not every state/college requires this much history (4 full years/4 full credits). Tennessee only requires US for one year, then they allow you to meander around in the "Social Studies" section for two more credits to graduate. That said, I know history classes are very important to many and prominently featured in the HLS/MP sequence. Personally, it's hard to find that margin when we are doing intense Latin/math/science every year and the Latin translation classes are themselves a lot of teaching on history, literature/poetry, humanities, etc. If a parent can't teach these upper history classes, then outsourcing becomes expensive and time intensive.

                Everyone is certainly welcome to ignore this-especially you history buffs, but I did want to add it to the thread for consideration. If a student is pursuing a course of studies in college that requires very robust history, then they definitely need as much as they can get. I myself am viewing much of our classical studies and Latin work as history, because it is!

                ETA: To clarify, I am not counting these other subjects as history credits. I'm merely saying that I'm satisfied with their historical studies irrespective of their proven credits. HTH!
                Last edited by pickandgrin; 06-08-2021, 09:56 AM.
                Festina lentē,
                Jessica P

                2021-2022 • 12th year HSing • 10th year MP
                12th • AP Latin online, DE Calculus & Physics, HLN
                10th • HLN, Latin online, MPOA
                7th • HLN & Home
                4th • HLN & Home
                Me: Third Form Summer Intensive MPOA

                Highlands Latin Nashville Cottage School

                Comment


                  #9
                  By the way: I love your soap box chronology speech, Tanya!
                  Festina lentē,
                  Jessica P

                  2021-2022 • 12th year HSing • 10th year MP
                  12th • AP Latin online, DE Calculus & Physics, HLN
                  10th • HLN, Latin online, MPOA
                  7th • HLN & Home
                  4th • HLN & Home
                  Me: Third Form Summer Intensive MPOA

                  Highlands Latin Nashville Cottage School

                  Comment


                    #10
                    This is all very true, pickandgrin. We do suffer when we do not know our history, though, so that's a consideration as well. Not that I think you'd disagree I am lucky that I have a lot of freedom in my state, so that outside requirements are not important - colleges are a different story. Of course there IS a lifetime to keep educating oneself, but the beginnings are important. It is an imperative necessity for me to help my kids understand how to look at modern history, and it's certainly true that the pattern is given to us by ancient authors: to that, though, we must keep adding factual knowledge.
                    DS (15)
                    DD (14)
                    DS (7)

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Totally agree! Since there's only so many hours in the day and credits in the year(s), I try to be attentive to what we can pickup outside formal studies for subjects like this. History is a great subject to fill out through reading for pleasure. I also appreciate the free online history courses from Hillsdale College and the Great Courses lectures.
                      Last edited by pickandgrin; 06-08-2021, 01:05 PM.
                      Festina lentē,
                      Jessica P

                      2021-2022 • 12th year HSing • 10th year MP
                      12th • AP Latin online, DE Calculus & Physics, HLN
                      10th • HLN, Latin online, MPOA
                      7th • HLN & Home
                      4th • HLN & Home
                      Me: Third Form Summer Intensive MPOA

                      Highlands Latin Nashville Cottage School

                      Comment


                        #12
                        (Seriously! You can't just put an emoji that says it all here. It has to be 10 emojis to post!)

                        Comment


                          #13
                          And if I've learned anything from classical education, it may be that there are no circumstances which call for ten emojis. Ha!
                          Festina lentē,
                          Jessica P

                          2021-2022 • 12th year HSing • 10th year MP
                          12th • AP Latin online, DE Calculus & Physics, HLN
                          10th • HLN, Latin online, MPOA
                          7th • HLN & Home
                          4th • HLN & Home
                          Me: Third Form Summer Intensive MPOA

                          Highlands Latin Nashville Cottage School

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I can see it now, in next season's The Classical Teacher. Featured article: "Emojis - The Death Knell of Western Civilization".

                            By the by, I think you can get away with just one emoji and nine spaces if I remember correctly if you end it with a character of some sort. The spaces are not visible anyway. Do not ask me why I have knowledge of this.
                            Last edited by Beorn; 06-09-2021, 10:20 PM.
                            2021/2022 (Planned) - 4th MP Year
                            MP Dad & HLN Science Teacher/Tutor
                            S - 7, 2nd Grader MP @ HLN & Home
                            D - 5, Kindergartener MP @ HLN & Home
                            S - 3, Junior Kindergartener MP @ Home

                            Comment


                              #15
                              .
                              2021/2022 (Planned) - 4th MP Year
                              MP Dad & HLN Science Teacher/Tutor
                              S - 7, 2nd Grader MP @ HLN & Home
                              D - 5, Kindergartener MP @ HLN & Home
                              S - 3, Junior Kindergartener MP @ Home

                              Comment

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